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As the group stage of the club championship has ended and the knockout stages are clear, it has never been more evident that the attempt to restructure the club football championship last year should really have been done in the club hurling championship.
There are 12 teams in both the Hurling Senior and Intermediate grades. 7 or 8 teams in Senior can put it up to each other (including Kiltale, who are streets ahead) on any given day. 1 or 2 others will give any of those 8 teams a scare or possibly beat them on a good day.
There are 8 first teams in Intermediate, again who would give each other a good rattle on any day and its less predictable.
The attempt to restructure the football last year is a perfect solution to the hurling championship. If the bottom team from each Senior group were relegated next year and 2nd from bottom in each group had a relegation play-off, it would mean that 3 teams would come down to Intermediate and 1 team would go up. That leaves 10 very competitive teams in Senior and no real bad hidings for any team.
Move the 2nd teams in the Intermediate grade into two separate championships where again no real demoralising beatings. Intermediate would be made up of 10 competitive teams with AGAIN, no bad beatings.
I'm involved in a team at the very lower end of the Senior grade and although it's nice to be Senior, there's no enjoyment taking on Kiltale at full strength when your own team aren't equipped to challenge them. For example, Dunderry gave them a walk-over in the last group game because they're safe???
I'd like to hear other people's opinions if possible, especially people involved in the bottom end of Senior (Clann na Gael, Boardsmill, Blackhall Gaels, Longwood)
bowza123 (Meath) - Posts: 42 - 25/08/2017 14:12:01
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Replying To bowza123: "As the group stage of the club championship has ended and the knockout stages are clear, it has never been more evident that the attempt to restructure the club football championship last year should really have been done in the club hurling championship.
There are 12 teams in both the Hurling Senior and Intermediate grades. 7 or 8 teams in Senior can put it up to each other (including Kiltale, who are streets ahead) on any given day. 1 or 2 others will give any of those 8 teams a scare or possibly beat them on a good day.
There are 8 first teams in Intermediate, again who would give each other a good rattle on any day and its less predictable.
The attempt to restructure the football last year is a perfect solution to the hurling championship. If the bottom team from each Senior group were relegated next year and 2nd from bottom in each group had a relegation play-off, it would mean that 3 teams would come down to Intermediate and 1 team would go up. That leaves 10 very competitive teams in Senior and no real bad hidings for any team.
Move the 2nd teams in the Intermediate grade into two separate championships where again no real demoralising beatings. Intermediate would be made up of 10 competitive teams with AGAIN, no bad beatings.
I'm involved in a team at the very lower end of the Senior grade and although it's nice to be Senior, there's no enjoyment taking on Kiltale at full strength when your own team aren't equipped to challenge them. For example, Dunderry gave them a walk-over in the last group game because they're safe???
I'd like to hear other people's opinions if possible, especially people involved in the bottom end of Senior (Clann na Gael, Boardsmill, Blackhall Gaels, Longwood)" 10 teams is still too many at Senior - you'd still have mismatches like Dunderry V Kiltale.
I'd be even more drastic and leave the 6 qualifiers this year in a SHC championship and put the next 6 in a SHC B. Trim and Longwood would be the big losers but can they say they are any better than the teams who qualified ahead of them?
Leave the intermediate as it is - I'd take the second teams out of it if I was doing anything.
Belt (Meath) - Posts: 205 - 25/08/2017 14:45:01
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Replying To Belt: "10 teams is still too many at Senior - you'd still have mismatches like Dunderry V Kiltale.
I'd be even more drastic and leave the 6 qualifiers this year in a SHC championship and put the next 6 in a SHC B. Trim and Longwood would be the big losers but can they say they are any better than the teams who qualified ahead of them?
Leave the intermediate as it is - I'd take the second teams out of it if I was doing anything." That's a very good alternative for the Senior! Although, is that not more or less the same as 6 Senior teams(SHC), 6 Intermediate Teams(SHC B) and 8 Junior teams (Current Intermediate 1st Teams)???
I definitely think the 2nd teams should have a Senior Reserve & A Reserve separate championship of their own and to be honest I don't really think the 2nd teams in Intermediate would mind. I know Kildalkey are in a quarter final, but it's nowhere near the same team they had on the 1st weekend of their championship.
bowza123 (Meath) - Posts: 42 - 25/08/2017 15:04:49
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Replying To bowza123: "As the group stage of the club championship has ended and the knockout stages are clear, it has never been more evident that the attempt to restructure the club football championship last year should really have been done in the club hurling championship.
There are 12 teams in both the Hurling Senior and Intermediate grades. 7 or 8 teams in Senior can put it up to each other (including Kiltale, who are streets ahead) on any given day. 1 or 2 others will give any of those 8 teams a scare or possibly beat them on a good day.
There are 8 first teams in Intermediate, again who would give each other a good rattle on any day and its less predictable.
The attempt to restructure the football last year is a perfect solution to the hurling championship. If the bottom team from each Senior group were relegated next year and 2nd from bottom in each group had a relegation play-off, it would mean that 3 teams would come down to Intermediate and 1 team would go up. That leaves 10 very competitive teams in Senior and no real bad hidings for any team.
Move the 2nd teams in the Intermediate grade into two separate championships where again no real demoralising beatings. Intermediate would be made up of 10 competitive teams with AGAIN, no bad beatings.
I'm involved in a team at the very lower end of the Senior grade and although it's nice to be Senior, there's no enjoyment taking on Kiltale at full strength when your own team aren't equipped to challenge them. For example, Dunderry gave them a walk-over in the last group game because they're safe???
I'd like to hear other people's opinions if possible, especially people involved in the bottom end of Senior (Clann na Gael, Boardsmill, Blackhall Gaels, Longwood)" totally agree with 10 teams.. far better off.
the only thing is if you relegate the bottom team from each group next year... there is nothing to say that the best 6 teams could end up in 1 group....
hence why there would be a need for seedings I feel....
But this has to happen soon. no one goes to watch hurling championship until business end as they know the best teams can cruise through groups and even if they lose its not end of world...
the big question is.... do the county board care enough... its clear they dont in my opinion
overthehill72 (Meath) - Posts: 334 - 25/08/2017 15:29:15
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A new restructure is badly needed. Dunderry lost to killyon by 49 points and then failed to field against Kiltale which I can hardly blame them but they will be senior next year and the same will happen again. A reasonable solution would be the 6 teams in the quarter final in 1 group. Top 2 go into semi final. In the other group have the remaining 6 teams, top 2 play third and fourth from group 1. The 6 quarter final teams make up group 1 the following year. Bottom 2 from group 2 play relegation to intermediate. The like of kiltale, kildalky killyon will avoid Dunderry Boardsmill Athboy unless the weaker teams improve and make a quarter final spot.
hurlinglad15 (Meath) - Posts: 36 - 25/08/2017 15:39:34
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Replying To hurlinglad15: "A new restructure is badly needed. Dunderry lost to killyon by 49 points and then failed to field against Kiltale which I can hardly blame them but they will be senior next year and the same will happen again. A reasonable solution would be the 6 teams in the quarter final in 1 group. Top 2 go into semi final. In the other group have the remaining 6 teams, top 2 play third and fourth from group 1. The 6 quarter final teams make up group 1 the following year. Bottom 2 from group 2 play relegation to intermediate. The like of kiltale, kildalky killyon will avoid Dunderry Boardsmill Athboy unless the weaker teams improve and make a quarter final spot." That's the way the Westmeath Senior is done as far as I know, well something similar anyway and if you talk to any Westmeath hurling people they will all agree that it's a very good and effective system.
Something needs to be done with Intermediate aswell though....
bowza123 (Meath) - Posts: 42 - 25/08/2017 15:56:19
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Replying To bowza123: "That's a very good alternative for the Senior! Although, is that not more or less the same as 6 Senior teams(SHC), 6 Intermediate Teams(SHC B) and 8 Junior teams (Current Intermediate 1st Teams)???
I definitely think the 2nd teams should have a Senior Reserve & A Reserve separate championship of their own and to be honest I don't really think the 2nd teams in Intermediate would mind. I know Kildalkey are in a quarter final, but it's nowhere near the same team they had on the 1st weekend of their championship." Meath Hurling Development and clubs have had a discussion on changing the SHC & IHC so it is a work in progress by all clubs. At the Hurling Devp meetings most clubs were represented and have now been asked to bring the below two options to Committees & Players and to have there answer/suggestions ready for the next meeting.
FORMAT OPTIONS DISCUSSED:
SHC, SH"B"C and IHC to be the same format.
Option 1:
•8 Teams.
•2 groups of 4.
•top 2 teams in each group play Semi finals.
•Bottom team in each group play relegation Final.
Option 2:
•8 Teams.
•Random Round 1 draw (4 games).
•2 groups of 4 (winners & Losers).
•Top 3 teams of winners group and top team only in Losers group play Semi finals.
•Bottom team in Losers group relegated.
ALLGAA32 (Meath) - Posts: 57 - 25/08/2017 21:48:20
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Replying To ALLGAA32: "Meath Hurling Development and clubs have had a discussion on changing the SHC & IHC so it is a work in progress by all clubs. At the Hurling Devp meetings most clubs were represented and have now been asked to bring the below two options to Committees & Players and to have there answer/suggestions ready for the next meeting.
FORMAT OPTIONS DISCUSSED:
SHC, SH"B"C and IHC to be the same format.
Option 1:
•8 Teams.
•2 groups of 4.
•top 2 teams in each group play Semi finals.
•Bottom team in each group play relegation Final.
Option 2:
•8 Teams.
•Random Round 1 draw (4 games).
•2 groups of 4 (winners & Losers).
•Top 3 teams of winners group and top team only in Losers group play Semi finals.
•Bottom team in Losers group relegated." Senior A : 6 teams -4 quarter and 2 semi final teams from 2017 - Kilatle, Kildalkey, Kilyon, Kilmessan, Ratoath, Dunboyne.
Senior B : Blackhall, Dunderry, Bmill, Trim, Longwood, C NaG,
Top 2 from Senior A go into semis, 3rd and 4th play 1 and 2 from senior 'B'. Bottom 2 from Senior A and Senior B get relegated each year.
I like this format as the quantity of games is retained from the current SHC however the quality should greatly improve. The only thing I don't like with ALLGAA32 proposals is that it shortens the championship by 2 games, giving up more calendar space for our stone age SFC format.
begining (UK) - Posts: 277 - 28/08/2017 09:29:46
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If there is a restructuring in the pipeline then, it's great to hear! It's long overdue and although I agree that the 2 games less means that they will still prioritise the SFC, it's a step in the right direction for club hurling for competitiveness. Hurling is always going to play second fiddle!
Will the same format be applied to the Intermediate grade? And what does this mean for the 2nd teams in Intermediate?
I honestly think that if there is separate championships for the 2nd teams (A Reserve & B Reserve championship), that it can be watched closely from the football end also to see how well it works and possibly applied there too.
bowza123 (Meath) - Posts: 42 - 28/08/2017 11:57:12
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Is there not a proposal for next year to have a Senior A and Senior B grading. The Intermediate semi finalists from this year go into Senior B and Intermediate also gets revamped as the Junior is not a match either.
The focus though has to be at club level. There are too many dual clubs where there is no equality.
Shivermetimber (Meath) - Posts: 124 - 28/08/2017 12:33:30
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Replying To Shivermetimber: "Is there not a proposal for next year to have a Senior A and Senior B grading. The Intermediate semi finalists from this year go into Senior B and Intermediate also gets revamped as the Junior is not a match either.
The focus though has to be at club level. There are too many dual clubs where there is no equality." Fully agree
Brownepat (Meath) - Posts: 463 - 29/08/2017 21:32:47
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